Hello, and welcome to Chaos to Calm podcast, episode number 53, I'm Sarah, the perimenopause naturopath, your guide through this journey of perimenopause. And if you're over 40 and feeling like you're changing, hormones are hijacking your mood. Energy, your weight, and you want to change that in a holistic way.

This is the place for you because each episode I share with you my views on what the heck's happening in your body, why you're feeling the way that you are and what you can do about it with actionable advice to help you feel more calm, in control, less stressed and more comfortable in your body.

I'm so glad that you've joined me today. Thank you so much for sharing your time with me. We are going to be discussing a hormone that I call one of your master hormones. One of the ones we really need to pay attention to if we want great hormonal health and overall health, let's dive straight in, shall we?

I want to introduce you to insulin, which you might have heard of before. It's a hormone made by the beta cells of your pancreas, which is a little tiny organ near your stomach. Insulin acts like a special key to help manage the glucose, the sugar levels in your blood. It helps keep your blood glucose levels just right.

Like Goldilocks porridge. We don't want too much. We don't want too little of our blood glucose and same goes for our insulin as well. We really just want it just right. So let's talk about glucose and blood glucose levels, because that and insulin, very linked and you need to understand what I'm talking about to understand the other.

So when we ate our foods broken down during the digestive process into smaller parts that can be used by our body. So from the food we get vitamins, minerals, our proteins that we eat are turned into amino acids and the carbohydrates are reduced down into simpler carbohydrates or sugars, glucose being one of them.

That glucose then enters your bloodstream and eventually it's used by cells for them to create energy so they can do what they're designed to do. So insulin's primary job is to regulate your blood sugar levels by promoting glucose uptake into the cells. If we use a lock and key analogy, I used this a couple of weeks ago when I was talking about it as well.

Insulin is like a key and it unlocks channels into your cells, allowing glucose to enter and only glucose to enter. So insulin only unlocks the channel that is specific to glucose to enter the cells. Once that glucose is inside the cells, it can hop into the mitochondria. Which are your cells, energy factories, and then it's used to produce the energy, the particular type of energy, the ATP that our cells use each day.

And it helps ourselves, our tissues, our organs, everything in our body, do what it needs to do so we can stay upright, active, and alive. And we need glucose. We need insulin. Of course, our bodies can run on fat and you've probably seen lots of things about that. Fasting talks about it a lot and burning our fat as an energy source, but ultimately it turns that fat into glucose as well.

So glucose is the fuel source. What does insulin do? Well, I've just mentioned that it's really important getting glucose into the cell and that's really it's critical role. So if insulin, if we don't have insulin or maybe the key is not turning, as effectively, it's not opening the channel fully, glucose can't get into the cells in the way that we need it to, or at the level that we need it to, and it can stay in the blood.

And that leads to high blood sugar levels, which is not desirable. More is not more. And also we don't want too little, like I said before. So if you have not enough insulin working and then, too much, glucose in your bloodstream, essentially your cells are starving. There's so much, energy floating around in your bloodstream, but it can't get into the cells.

And also on the other hand, we don't want too much insulin as well because then your blood sugar levels are going to go too low. There's so much insulin, it's encouraging your cells to open up those channels and really let the glucose in. It can go too low and you can slip into a coma.

Now, insulin is really important in, like, it doesn't just let the glucose into the cells. It actually is really, like an office manager, it's taking care of managing the influx of glucose. And when there's not enough glucose other times. So when there's more glucose in your blood than your body needs right away, insulin is going to help manage this by getting your body to store the extra away in your liver, your muscles, and your adipose tissue, which is your fat cells.

So it's very helpful, a very helpful office manager, making sure nothing goes to waste, which is really important when we were primal, our cave people selves, and we didn't have constant supplies of food. So there would be periods where, say over summer, they ate a lot more carbohydrates and built up their fat stores because things would be lean over the winter time.

Now, however, we have a constant supply of food, so we don't really need to stockpile or eat that amount of carbohydrates to create more fat cells so that we've got stores for the winter, like a little bear or a squirrel. But the squirrel at least tucks the food away whole, we were tucking it away in our fat cells.

Okay. So insulin helps the storage. It takes it to your liver and it encourages the liver to store glucose in the form of glycogen. So think of your liver like a pantry. It's like a medium, timeframe store there and it can be easily accessed. Now, I don't really want a lot of fat around our liver because you can get non alcoholic fatty liver, which disrupts the function of your liver and can ultimately, impact your hormones as well as your overall health there as well.

Our muscles are a great storage place. It makes sense to for us to store glucose in our muscles because they're the ones most demanding of glucose. And if it's right there available for them immediately, it makes it easy when we're running or doing something or in case of emergency we are being chase by a wildebeest. We have instant energy access there.

Obviously not many wildebeests chasing us these days anymore. Now the downside with the muscle storage is actually we can only store about 500 grams of glycogen, in our muscles. So the rest has to go into fat storage and insulin will prompt your adipose or your fat cells to store glucose there.

And it's, it's stored inside the fat cells. So. Think of this as a really long term energy reserve, ready to be used, in the middle of winter when there's not many animals for us around to hunt and, and, or, berries to gather and eat. Now, unlike the muscle, which has that finite glycogen store, fat cells are infinitely expandable.

They can expand as much as we need. Which is great, except if you're trying to fit into your favorite genes, it's not so great. So that's where, that's how insulin helps our body manage an excess or influx of glucose. And also when we have a shortfall of glucose to create energy molecules from, but insulin also has other roles besides blood glucose management.

It's a, it's a, It is an anabolic hormone, which means it promotes building up of cells and tissues. It promotes growth. So it promotes muscle growth, insulin enhances protein synthesis in muscle, helping them grow and repair, and it, directs the resources to where we need to build and maintain our muscle tissue.

I've talked about how it encourages our fat storage. So one thing, when insulin is high, we go into fat storage mode. Lipogenesis is the name of it. It's fat creation. And when insulin is high and we're in fat creation mode, we are not in fat breakdown or lipolysis. So that's, Important to know as well.

High insulin means you're going to be in fat storage mode and overall insulin promotes the growth of various tissues and make sure that your body has enough stored energy to function efficiently. Like it really is an important role because without it, we're flopping around on the couch or we're stuck in bed and no energy to do anything there at all.

So thank you insulin for doing your job. Let's talk about when our cells, like our kids and they stop listening to your pancreas and insulin, the hormone that it generates for us. This is called insulin resistance. And this is really important to know because it can become quite an issue in perimenopause and menopause, which I'll talk about why in a little bit here as well.

So insulin resistance occurs when the cells in your muscles and in your fat and in your liver are not responding to insulin. And so your cells can not take up glucose from your blood so easily because, well, yeah, your cells are not listening. Think of your kids when you're like, Hey, could you clean up your room and dinner's nearly ready and they're busy, on their, on a device playing a game, or maybe they're doing something else, so they're not really listening.

And you ask them again. In a moderately louder tone and they still don't do anything. And then you ask again and again and again, until you're shouting and they're like, what, why are you shouting? Well, why didn't you just ask? That's what's happening with your cells and insulin in insulin resistance.

So your cells are not listening. They're not letting insulin put the key in the lock and open the channel for the glucose to go into the cells. So you could have a whole bunch of glucose in your bloodstream, but it's not getting into your cells and your cells are starving. They can't do what they need to do because they don't have glucose to help create their energy molecules.

So that is insulin resistance. Think of your cells ignoring you until your pancreas is shouting at them. And then you have so much insulin in your bloodstream that then you can end up with really low blood sugar levels as well. So you get stuck in a cycle there where your cells are not listening. Your pancreas has to make more and more insulin just to get, or just to be out and manage your blood glucose levels in the way that it needs, that we need it to.

And then you can get crash into that low blood sugar level. And that's where you can really get stuck in a cycle of eating and then feeling hungry. A couple of hours later, because there's been too much insulin in your bloodstream. And now there's not enough glucose left in your bloodstream.

So your brain and your body's like, Oh my gosh, you need to eat right now. Quick, quick, go grab something, anything. And that's when you're more likely to seek those instant energy hit foods, like the refined carbohydrates, sugar, chips, crackers. Yeah. Lollies, sweet drinks and things like that as well. And yeah, you get stuck in that cycle and of needing, feeling hungry every couple of hours as your insulin is, and your blood glucose levels are bouncing up and down.

 I said before when insulin is high, we're in fats storage mode, so in insulin resistance, we've got so much insulin pumping around in our body that you're going to be in fat storage mode for most of the time. It makes it extremely difficult to lose weight when you're in fat storage mode.

It really needs to be corrected, that insulin resistance, that biochemistry needs to be balanced if you want to lose weight. Okay. And often that fat mass that we're accumulating in that time is the visceral fat. Now, visceral fat is very dangerous for us and makes us predisposed to more chronic diseases and long term illnesses.

It's the fat that accumulates around your organs, around your liver and in your abdomen there as well. Much more dangerous than your muffin tops or the way the fat mass around your thighs or or your arms. So insulin resistance When I talk about insulin, insulin isn't inherently bad It's actually as I've already described really useful molecule Like we need it to be functioning, to be upright and active and, and doing all the things that we do.

It's imperative. It's when it gets out of balance or our blood sugar levels and, cells become insulin resistance, then Houston, we have a problem. And that's what I want to just talk to you about now is to build that picture so you can hopefully see by the end of this episode how important insulin is and how important managing insulin and keeping it in a healthy range is.

So if when we have insulin resistance it can It is a key factor in many Reproductive metabolic health there as well. It's a factor in metabolic syndrome which becomes more prevalent post menopause for women Metabolic syndrome is a cluster of symptoms, rather than a, like an overt issue. But I guess you could think of insulin resistance as being a key driver or a key factor in behind metabolic syndrome.

So metabolic syndrome includes high blood pressure, high blood sugars imbalance in your cholesterol levels. So too high cholesterol levels also can have a fatty liver as part of it there too. And that weight and weight gain and particularly around the middle there, like a waist and abdomen and your triglyceride levels as part of your cholesterol levels, triglyceride levels quite elevated in that instance.

And they're the ones we really want to worry about. Just as an aside, I'll do an episode on them another time as well. So insulin resistance contributes to all of those condition all of those, factors in the metabolic syndrome because of the impact that it has on your immune system, your cell function, your fat storage, and, your blood glucose management in a similar way, it impacts your reproductive health.

So your menstrual cycle and your period, because it impacts other hormones like estrogen and testosterone and, and conversely, those hormones impact insulin as well. So if we have high insulin levels because we haven't been managing our blood sugar levels well, and. Our stress levels, I'll talk about that too.

We can end up with high insulin or insulin resistance, and that can contribute to conditions like PCOS, polycystic ovarian syndrome. And that will can give you long cycles, so say like 60 day cycles and contribute to weight gain and, acne and hair growth, that dark hair growth there as well.

The increase in insulin influences your androgens, your, what we consider to be your male hormones, like testosterone. And that is the mechanism of action behind those changes in your menstrual cycle. Because we're not making the, it's out of balance with our testosterone and estrogen and progesterone and, and those hormones.

And we're not getting to the right levels to be able to ovulate. We need a certain amount of estrogen to encourage ovulation. And if that's not happening, or if the ratios of that are not right, then you're going to have a long cycle there as well. So insulin resistance can also impact your brain function and contribute to mood swings, anxiety, and cognition or thinking issues.

So high blood sugar levels can lead to inflammation in your body and your brain. And that impacts your neuron function in your brain, your neurotransmitter mix and your mood regulation there as well. And I just, want to point out what might be obvious to you right now. Lots of these things that I'm talking about can often be confused as perimenopause symptoms.

So maybe if you're in your, mid to late thirties, maybe early forties, and you're experiencing some of these, perhaps it's not solely perimenopause. Perhaps it's actually blood sugar and insulin regulation issues, in which case, balancing those should see a, a return to a more regular cycle and more stable and even mood and, and that's actually a good point as well.

When our blood sugar levels are spiking high and low, it can make us be quite angry and aggressive. And hangry, basically. And, like the chocolate bar ad says, you're not yourself when you're hangry and you are not. And you might say and do things that you regret soon afterwards as well.

But it's very hard to be, a reasonable person when your blood sugar levels are out of balance, because your brain is just screaming at you to go and get something to eat. You need food and it will just drive you to get anything, any instant energy source into your body. So yeah, the impact on your mental health is it will contribute to mood swings and can also contribute to things like anxiety, but also having trouble thinking and feeling foggy in your brain.

If your blood sugar levels are too low, too high you can get the same outcome then. And also, if your neurons in your brain, they're the little cells doing all the hard labor, find, rifling through the filing cabinets of our memories and what we know to find what we need to think about, to find that person's name, to get that automatic process working for you there when you you're doing your work or knowing how to create an email response to someone.

All of that, our neurons are working feverishly in our brains for us, and they need glucose to be able to do that. So if you don't have enough glucose in your body circulating in your blood, and it's not getting into those cells, including the neurons, they can't function. They can't do their work. And so neither can you, you can't do your work.
You're feeling foggy in the head. You're having a hard time concentrating. You're having memory problems. And even over time, that poor insulin regulation in the brain has actually been linked to an increased risk of Alzheimer's and other neuro degenerative disorders. So insulin is imperative for neurons to get the glucose to make the energy molecules that they need so that they can do what we need them to do.

And I've heard Alzheimer's referred to as type three diabetes and it, that really reflects the importance of managing your blood sugar levels and insulin. And like I said earlier, at the start of this episode, it's really. It's something to consider is that, managing insulin in men is managing your blood sugar levels and vice versa there as well.

So you, you don't have one without the other. Now I want to talk about stress and cortisol because that has a massive impact on insulin and they really, I've done an earlier podcast episode, apologies, I didn't look up what number episode it was, but I'll link to it in the show notes. And I talk about how cortisol is the, is a master hormone as well.

So from my perspective, we have cortisol, we have insulin, they are your master hormones. They are really important to manage and balance if you want health in your hormones, your digestion, your immune system, whatever it is, they're, they're really important. So high cortisol levels come when our body's responding to lots of stressors.
As part of our stress response is cortisol is released. Part of cortisol's job is to increase our blood sugar levels, our blood glucose levels. And so therefore it has an effect on a insulin levels. And high blood sugar levels and high insulin can be a stressor on the body, a physical stressor. And so if we have high, high insulin and insulin resistance and our blood sugar levels are bouncing all over the place, that's going to be increasing cortisol.
So you see it can get stuck in a loop with the loser being you. And you trying to function and in this busy phase of your life. Does it make it harder to manage stress and mean that you're constantly being triggered or more reactive to stress and stressors there as well? So Thyroid function, another massive one as well that you can, a lot of the symptoms might seem like perimenable symptoms, but actually could be a sign that your thyroid is out of balance.

And again, I've done podcast episodes on thyroid on your thyroid and thyroid hormones there as well. So do have a listen to that as well. If you want to learn more about it and see if it is something that might be an issue at play for you, but also know that in perimenopause, we can become more, likely to develop a thyroid issue.

So thyroid, insulin resistance impacts the conversion of your inactive thyroid hormone, T4, to the active form, which is T3. So that can potentially give you symptoms of a slow hypothyroid, which are things like brain fog. Weight gain, slow, mentation, slow thinking, iron issues like low iron can be associated with a slow thyroid.

And so you see again, like there's that muddying and also low mood is a massive one with a slow thyroid. So there's a lot of crossover between perimenopause symptoms and your thyroid symptoms there as well. So. And if our insulin levels are impacting that and reducing the amount of active thyroid hormone available to us, we've got that sort of, subclinical hypothyroidism happening where we're just, not necessarily got a thyroid issue, but there's a problem in the hormone balance.

So let's talk about appetite hormones here as well, because insulin can impact your leptin. So leptin tells your brain when you're full, you're eating away. And eating body releases leptin, it gets to the brain and it tells you, Oh, you've had enough now you're full. So that's released as your stomach expands as food goes into it.

And that's why, sometimes you might joke about having 20 minutes to eat before you feel full, get as much in as you can. In that time, it does take a bit of, there's a bit of lag between what's happening with this stomach and by the time it gets to your brain. But, if you have, your insulin levels, high insulin levels can lead to leptin resistance as well.
So your body's not doing the same thing that's happening with your insulin resistance. It's not listening to the leptin, your brain, and so you just keep eating. Makes it harder for you to feel full and means that you risk overeating. Every time I just wanted to say as well I talked before about how insulin impacts estrogen.

I forgot to mention that estrogen, the way that it impacts insulin is as, estrogen helps improve the sensitivity or the responsiveness of our cells to insulin. So in perimenopause, we have estrogen bouncing up and down. So it can be, make us very sensitive to insulin or very insensitive to insulin there as well.

And over time, as we get towards menopause and beyond, we become more naturally, more insulin resistance, resistant, and maybe you might be fine managing your weight through perimenopause. But when you get to menopause, it's incredibly hard to not put on weight for many people, many women because you become, Insulin resistant.

So we really need to pay attention to that biochemistry and keep our blood sugar levels and eat in a way that supports and optimizes our blood sugar levels and, and insulin there as well. So they're a nice steady wave within that healthy range rather than big spikes up and down. I mentioned before that insulin high insulin levels can promote inflammation that low grade immune response, and that's been associated with many health conditions, including cardiovascular disease and some cancers and autoimmune disorders. So it is important that we reduce inflammation in our body, that we reduce that immune response and save it for only when there's actually something that wrong or something that needs attention and addressing.

I mentioned with PCOS as well that your high insulin or insulin resistance has been linked with skin conditions and like acne. But also your hair growth, those little pesky dark, very strong hairs can be worsened if your, sex hormones like testosterone, out of balance. Now I've talked about how estrogen helps enhance insulin sensitivity and makes ourselves more responsive to that.

And so conversely, low estrogen means that we're less responsive there as well, and then is going to mean more insulin in our bloodstream. And therefore. More fat storage and more difficulty burning fat, and losing weight or avoiding that fat storage around the abdomen there as well. And our last, last episode I talked about calorie counting, and this is a classic example of why it sucks and why I don't want you to, I don't want it for you because if you are eating too little.

It triggers a famine mode in your body and which puts you into fat storage mode. So if your insulin is high, you're going to be in fat storage mode, but also if you're not eating enough, you are going to get put into fat storage mode there as well. And that I see, I speak to lots of women and they come to me because they're restricting calories, counting calories and restricting them and it's not working, they're losing weight.
If anything, they're gaining weight and, Then they restrict more because they think, oh, well, I'm eating too much. I should eat even less. And then our bodies, our female bodies are very sensitive to that sense of famine because even though we know, well, I'm not going to have another baby for whatever the reasons are that, or it's with certainty it's not going to happen, our body's still quite primal from that respect and it doesn't know it and it doesn't care.

It's always primal. Preparing for the possibility that there could be a baby on board, that it needs to be able to provide nutrients for, for it to grow. So if it senses that there is not enough food, it will impact your period. You may period might go missing, which you might assume is perimenopause, but actually it just could be because you're not eating enough and it will try to build your fat stores.

Okay. So one of the things I've talked, that's really been a recurring theme through this episode is that lots of our perimenopause symptoms might actually be related to something like an insulin resistance or blood glucose imbalance in your body and your cells not being able to get enough energy glucose in to make energy molecules there as well.

Brain fog, poor concentration, poor memory and missing periods or lots of those things might actually be. It's really related to your blood sugar levels and your insulin levels there as well. And I mentioned before as well about how the decline in estrogen impacts our insulin sensitivity, but it also can lead to changes in our brain's perception of hunger and fullness.

So it doesn't, it doesn't just only impact insulin. What we know about estrogen or we're learning more and more all the time is that it has a really strong impact on all of ourselves and all of our systems and there as well. So you can get more cravings and feel more hunger in this stage or phase of life.

So let's talk about some things to do to manage your insulin levels, because hopefully by now you're seeing that how important it is to keep it in balance and check along with our blood glucose levels as well. So of course, I'm going to say. Have a balanced diet. Yes, we want one that's rich in whole foods, not processed foods.

So lots of fiber, healthy fats, phytoestrogens, protein, they're all really important for balanced, blood glucose levels and insulin there as well to help support and optimize that biochemistry there as well, if you're going to have something sweet. Please have it at the end of a meal, like have your food first with your protein and your fats and then have your sweets.

Don't have like soft drinks in between. Even the artificial sweetened ones, they'll still impact your blood sugar levels and a digestive response there as well. One thing that's a neat little trick that I think is really great is after you've eaten, So yes, of course, regular physical activity, moving our bodies, building muscle mass, because they're the powerhouses of glucose burning and is really important for us.

Not necessarily lots of cardio, but more let's go focus on strength training and resistance work there to build muscle mass and flexibility. But after your dinner, Or after any meal, go for a little walk or have a little dance for five or 10 minutes. And that's really, if, especially if you suspect that you might be insulin resistant and, though they can keep your blood sugar levels down and help improve your overall metabolic health.
I just had a brainwave that's not in my notes, and I want to tell you all about it. One way that you can work out, well, am I insulin resistant is to check your waist to height ratio. So take your height measurement in centimeters and your waist measurement in centimeters, and you're going to divide your waist by your height.

And that will give you a ratio. And we want that to be below 0. 5. So have a check of that out and and see, and then, you track that over time. If this is something that you're doing, trying to lose abdominal weight. And your waist is changing, then it's a great indicator of how you're going in terms of managing your insulin levels and blood glucose levels.
So that's how you check if you might be insulin resist
tant. Of course, check with a practitioner like me or your doctor to have it more thoroughly assessed, but it's something you can do at home. Now, I want to talk about stress management, of course, but because it is really important to help with our insulin management and insulin resistance, but it, I'm not going to just tell you it's all mindfulness and meditation.

Because it's not, I want you to focus on self care and self care, like daily self care habits that really nourish and support your body so that you are less reactive to the stressors in your life. Because let's face it, we can't always reduce or remove those stressors. And we've also got the combo of progesterone declining in perimenopause and menopause.
So that that's our natural stress resilience hormone. So that's declining. Life is super hectic for most women at this phase of life, you need your daily self care habits. So eating nourishing food most of the time, drinking water, staying hydrated, getting safe sun exposure. So you're making vitamin D, connecting with other people, finding joy and laughter and happiness, and engaging in some physical movement that isn't flogging you and draining you, but something that you actually really enjoy doing there as well.
And sleep, sleep is the gold standard of self care, like it is the ultimate item in your self care toolkit. It's really important and, something to think about as well as that laughter and, and having fun and playful playing helps reduce your stress levels because it triggers the release of endorphins and they're the body's natural feel good chemicals and can lower cortisol.

So, and removing cortisol from your body or just not making so much cortisol is there as well. So do what kids do and have play and set some time aside each day for you to do something that brings you joy and that makes you happy. I I get my clients to think of their joy list and things that they do that they enjoy and that, and have fun for them and they have to include something every day. It's that important, right? I've talked to the end of a very long episode. Thanks for staying with me here. I hope that by now you can see why I say insulin is a master hormone alongside cortisol. It's so important. It regulates multiple bodily functions, our glucose metabolism. Yes. Our fat storage, our protein synthesis, it influences other hormones, organs, systems.

It really sets the tone for your health overall. And it's not just related to that blood glucose management. It is interconnected across the body. It does a whole bunch of different things. It impacts your reproductive, your hormonal health, which is what we're all about here, because we want to con we want to help what I want for you is Like the hormone fluctuations of perimenopause are normal.

It's, it's what happens, but we can influence how big those fluctuations are and how our body adapts and adjusts to them. And that's something that we can do with food and with lifestyle and things like managing our blood glucose levels and our insulin there as well. So that's why I'm so passionate in talking about managing your blood sugar levels and your biochemistry.

To help with your perimenopause experience, because it does decrease your symptoms when we get that right for you. When that's in a nice, smooth, healthy range, you feel better. Your energy is better. Your brain functions better. You, your hormones are less chaotic and wild. Like it really does pay dividends.

So it is really crucial for maintaining your overall health and working to prevent or avoid insulin resistance there as well. Now, if you would like some more guidance in how to do this, like how the nuts and bolts of what to eat and how to eat and what to change in your lifestyle, if you really want to, like change your perimenopause experience or your menopause experience, either way, what I teach my, in my principles around food and your lifestyle work, regardless of what stage or phase of perimenopause or menopause you're at, I am launching, which I'm really excited about because this is going to make this information a lot more available to many of you working with me and, and with Wendy and, one to one and small group situation is going to cost you a couple of thousand dollars and not everyone can, find those funds to do that. So I've, all that I know, all that I've developed in the last six years and know about women's health, especially in perimenopause into a four week program that I'm calling PerimenoGO.
I'm so excited about it because who wants to pause, who wants to stop, and it will teach you all about how to eat, what to eat, what to change in your lifestyle and with recipes and a meal plan, if that's your thing, otherwise I'll teach you how to put your plate together so that you don't have to be reliant on a meal plan for forever.
And it is launching 15th of July. You can find out more about it right now. And, as well as, other resources and submitting a question to me, all those sorts of things. At the show notes, I will have the link for you to find out more about PerimenoGO. So go to www.chaostocalmpodcast.com.

Make sure you're subscribed so you don't miss an episode but you can find out more about Perimeno Go and add your name to the wait list so that you are first to find out more when it's available. launched and also access a founder's price. So super special price that won't be repeated ever again.

So I hope to see you in a PerimeterGO. I, as always, if you have any questions or comments, go to the show notes and you can submit them via text to me there. Thank you so much for listening and sharing your time with me today. As always, I can. I really value, that gift that you've given me next time, I'm really looking forward to talking about the role of the liver and what it means for your health in perimenopause. I know it sounds dull, but it's actually going to be super exciting. And just like talking about insulin and the master hormone, your liver and your liver health is super important for a smooth and pleasant perimenopause experience.

 Until next time. I hope you have a great week and thank you so much for sharing your time with me today.